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M11 - Escape Velocity

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  • M11 - Escape Velocity

    Mission Discussion Thread

  • #2
    The look of this mission brings the topic of "Model damage" to mind. I hope LEGO is providing an extra-special set of beams for the Strike Pad mechanism.
    FIRST LEGO League Mentor and Referee/Head Referee since 2011.

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    • #3
      I also hope that the spacecraft doesn't stick on any parts of the vertical launch beam.
      FIRST LEGO League Mentor and Referee/Head Referee since 2011.

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      • #4
        The pieces are all standard LEGO, as you probably guessed. It seems fairly solid, and the spacecraft is working fine in limited home use....
        Steve Scherr
        Referee and Judge, Virginia-DC, Maryland, and Ohio
        FLL Global Head Referee

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        • #5
          I've had the same results as Steve; the model seems OK. I think this is going to be a very popular mission until the teams find out just how hard & fast the pad has to be hit to get a score.
          Kansas City Region Head Ref 2014-present
          KC Region coaches and teams can ask FLL robot game rules questions at kcfllref@gmail.com

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          • #6
            Originally posted by someonewhobikes View Post
            I've had the same results as Steve; the model seems OK. I think this is going to be a very popular mission until the teams find out just how hard & fast the pad has to be hit to get a score.
            I don't have a set of models yet. Is the answer "very"?
            FIRST LEGO League Mentor and Referee/Head Referee since 2011.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Tom Mosher View Post
              I don't have a set of models yet. Is the answer "very"?
              I think so. The idea of showing off by using a hammer to ring a bell has fueled Carney games for years; this is the same thing. When you see it work it's fascinating (for me, anyway). The spaceship looks like it won't make it, but then it's almost pulled into position. You'll have to see it yourself, of course, but I'm sure I have some returning kids that will be enamored with this.

              However, there is a problem. The part of the LEGO piece that contacts the mat when you hit the platform is an edge, not a curve. After hitting the thing only a few times yesterday our mat has a serious dent in it. I think a full season of practice is going to result in a torn mat.
              Kansas City Region Head Ref 2014-present
              KC Region coaches and teams can ask FLL robot game rules questions at kcfllref@gmail.com

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              • #8
                At one of our training sessions we had a person set a heavy set of bricks on the strike pad, therefore holding the rocket slightly up from its initial position. It seems to violate the intent of the mission but scores according to the wording highlighted in green. Is this a valid scoring configuration?

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by rwhillock View Post
                  At one of our training sessions we had a person set a heavy set of bricks on the strike pad, therefore holding the rocket slightly up from its initial position. It seems to violate the intent of the mission but scores according to the wording highlighted in green. Is this a valid scoring configuration?
                  That is an excellent question.

                  Based on the mission scoring text under "Technically Speaking", I think that would score points, because it "stayed up" and it was due to "pressing ... the Strike Pad".

                  True enough that it doesn't cover the method implied in the "Simply Speaking" text, but that text cannot be used in mission scoring.
                  Last edited by Tom Mosher; 09-10-2018, 04:55 PM.
                  FIRST LEGO League Mentor and Referee/Head Referee since 2011.

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                  • #10
                    This also raises a bit of a semantic issue about what the 'slash' character means in the text "pressing/hitting". To me typically the slash means "or", but that's only based on my personal experience and I don't know if that is universal in all languages that the rules are translated into.
                    FIRST LEGO League Mentor and Referee/Head Referee since 2011.

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                    • #11
                      Hmmm, and the "so fast and high" aren't marked as "Scoring Requirement Signals" either.
                      Steve Scherr
                      Referee and Judge, Virginia-DC, Maryland, and Ohio
                      FLL Global Head Referee

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by scherrsj View Post
                        Hmmm, and the "so fast and high" aren't marked as "Scoring Requirement Signals" either.
                        Indeed. Uncertainty continues.
                        FIRST LEGO League Mentor and Referee/Head Referee since 2011.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Tom Mosher View Post
                          This also raises a bit of a semantic issue about what the 'slash' character means in the text "pressing/hitting". To me typically the slash means "or", but that's only based on my personal experience and I don't know if that is universal in all languages that the rules are translated into.
                          I've seen people use a "/" or both AND & OR. Used to work for an Exec that had the "/" as one of his presentation pet peeves -- he hated it specifically because it's ambiguous, and there are perfectly good, short, words that can be used. So....it's the perfect thing to expect in FLL rules.
                          Kansas City Region Head Ref 2014-present
                          KC Region coaches and teams can ask FLL robot game rules questions at kcfllref@gmail.com

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                          • #14
                            I would like to revisit this one. It does seem to me , according to the way the scoring requirements are written, that ANY pressing or simply putting something on the launch pad and makes the spacecraft elevate some distance and not drop back down, is a valid scoring technique
                            Are there further thoughts on this mission?

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by rwhillock View Post
                              At one of our training sessions we had a person set a heavy set of bricks on the strike pad, therefore holding the rocket slightly up from its initial position. It seems to violate the intent of the mission but scores according to the wording highlighted in green. Is this a valid scoring configuration?
                              Originally posted by J Church View Post
                              I would like to revisit this one. It does seem to me , according to the way the scoring requirements are written, that ANY pressing or simply putting something on the launch pad and makes the spacecraft elevate some distance and not drop back down, is a valid scoring technique
                              Are there further thoughts on this mission?
                              If the Robot did the pressing or simply putting, that would be fine. I can't see the advantage to the team, but it would be allowed. Of course, if a person set a heavy set of bricks on the strike pad, that would violate rule R10 - HANDLING DURING THE MATCH "You are not allowed to interact with any part of the Field that's not COMPLETELY in Base".

                              Am I missing your intention here?

                              Alan
                              Head Referee Israel
                              Global Head Referee

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