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Scoring at Matches

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  • Scoring at Matches

    Last year we had several issues with scoring at both our regional and super-regional. The mistakes both hurt and helped us. In all cases we notified the referees and the tournament organizer. It happened pretty badly in our favor at last years super regional, and we only found out after the awards were handed out and the tournament was over. We notified the organizer immediately, and can only hope we didn't get someone else's award.

    This year I'm seeing the same thing again, and I'm not sure what to tell the kids to do. At our regional this weekend, the ref didn't even let the kids look at the scoring sheet after each round. We brought it to the attention of the tournament organizer and by the last round the kids were reviewing. Several times the referees didn't know the mission rules. On all three of our table rounds, we got different scores than we should've.

    I generally don't like bringing issues like this up during the tournament, because it makes me feel like an ill-mannered coach at a little league game, and everything is so rushed. All of our refs and judges are volunteers, and I am grateful for their time. I've offered to help train refs prior to tournaments (politely declined). But this is the 2nd year for some of my team kids and they know they aren't getting the right scores. In this case, because they didn't get to see their score sheets at the table directly after the match, they had no opportunity to point out an error.

    I'm looking for advice on how to coach the kids through this. On the one hand, I want them to learn how to politely point out errors and stand firm to get issues fixed. On the other hand, I don't want them demanding things (like score sheet review) from an adult. Any tips?

  • #2
    I would have a chat with your region
    --
    Fort Worth Robotics - North Texas Region Team #455
    Technical coach, baker of the cookies, keeper of the time, transporter of the travel field walls, finder of the spare parts, maker of the pop culture references that only the other tall people understand.

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    • #3
      Yeah, I'd talk with somebody up top about that. We had a very professional experience at the state tournament yesterday. All refs were using a tablet so they could show the kids exactly which missions they had scored and we had our score before we walked away from the table. The one minor issue we had (the ref wasn't going to give us credit for a satellite where only the antennae thingy was over the two lines) was quickly resolved. I was proud of my team because my kid didn't get upset, but rather he turned to me and asked for the challenge guide. But while he was still looking up the page, the ref had already called over the head of the tournament to get it clarified. The head of the tournament looked at it at the same moment as my kid found the mission description in the challenge guide, and they quickly resolved the issue (in our favor!). But regardless of the result, I appreciated the professional way they handled it.

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      • #4
        I'm not sure who to chat with, and I know they have such trouble getting enough refs and judges. I can't imagine they are unaware of the problem.....

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        • #5
          At every tournament I've attended in four years of coaching, at the end of the match the refs go over the scores with the technicians at the table to make sure they agree with the scoring, then have them sign the score sheet to that effect. I guess I thought this was standard practice.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by nedcook View Post
            At every tournament I've attended in four years of coaching, at the end of the match the refs go over the scores with the technicians at the table to make sure they agree with the scoring, then have them sign the score sheet to that effect. I guess I thought this was standard practice.
            Ditto. In Minnesota, the referees go over the score sheet with the kids, and one of the kids from the team has to sign the score sheet. The sheet is then handed over to someone else to enter the score in the system. Mistakes are still made sometimes, but usually teams know if the score is not correct, and the officials are receptive to quickly correcting it if they are informed of an error. At the end of the tournament, the teams receive an envelope that contains the score sheets, along with their judging rubrics.

            I will add that in our region, calling it a "score sheet" is a bit misleading. The sheet just records the state of the board and what occurred for the different missions. The sheet doesn't calculate the actual score, and the referees can't tell the kids what the robot score was. The sheet just provides the raw data that is used in the scoring app to actually calculate the score.
            Last edited by timdavid; 12-17-2018, 10:50 AM.

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            • #7
              amy.eddy

              I don't know where you are from, but you can go to the FLL web site and get contact information for your local FLL partner/affiliate. They will know how to direct your questions. Do not assume that they are aware of the rules problem (sounds like this is a rule interpretation problem, not a scoring problem).

              Here's the web page that will let you look up your local partner in the US.

              https://www.firstinspires.org/find-l...hsfp=304813418

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              • #8
                Originally posted by nedcook View Post
                At every tournament I've attended in four years of coaching, at the end of the match the refs go over the scores with the technicians at the table to make sure they agree with the scoring, then have them sign the score sheet to that effect. I guess I thought this was standard practice.
                All of the FLL tournaments I have attended here in South Texas as a Coach or Volunteer in the last 9~10 years have done this.

                As a Head Ref, I have had to use a copy of the rules to explain to teams why they didn't get any points. In all cases, there was no dispute over what happened in the match but the team misunderstood the rules and though what they did would get points. In the end, the teams have agreed that they needed to do something different to actually get points.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by amy.eddy View Post
                  I'm not sure who to chat with, and I know they have such trouble getting enough refs and judges. I can't imagine they are unaware of the problem.....
                  Talk with the regional partner - the folks who run FIRST LEGO League in your region. Every coach should have contact info for that person - they're the same folks who handle your event registration and paying entry fees, for example.
                  FIRST LEGO League Mentor and Referee/Head Referee since 2011.

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